tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8637125351921336084.post8882387870044247066..comments2024-03-19T00:26:30.753-07:00Comments on The Jesus Blog: Was the Last Supper on Wednesday? (A Review of Colin Humphreys' The Mystery of the Last Supper)Anthony Le Donnehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/01282792648606976883noreply@blogger.comBlogger6125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8637125351921336084.post-131979553095032232017-04-25T07:51:56.158-07:002017-04-25T07:51:56.158-07:00For those who are wondering whether or not to read...For those who are wondering whether or not to read Humphreys’ book, I would personally recommend it. The issues mentioned in the review above do not, in my view, represent genuine weaknesses in Humphreys’ work. Humphreys repeatedly stresses the vagaries of our knowledge of the Jewish calendar. Hence, he continually works with ranges of dates rather than absolute dates; that is to say, he quotes, for instance, a date when a new moon could have been cited, and a second later date when it might have been cited given poor weather conditions, and so on. While, therefore, claims like, “It should go without saying that using calculations with a 24-hour margin of error cannot be conclusive for solving the problem of an apparent 24-hour chronological discrepancy” have a certain rhetorical flourish, they are not, in my view, substantive. If one can establish the range of possibilities for when a month might have begun, then one can rule out certain options, and hence decide between two options separated by only 24 hours. Suppose, by way of analogy, we have two different estimates for today’s temperature (23 and 24 degrees), and suppose it’s actually 25 degrees, and suppose we have a thermometer which measures the temperature with a 1 degree margin of error. We can clearly then decide between our estimates (23 and 24), since we can establish ranges of possibility. And that is the procedure that Humphreys employs here, to good effect. (Note: I think Humphreys may have overlooked one important point, namely that intercalated months are, acc. to Beckwith, of necessity 30 days in length, which would require Humphreys to increase his ranges of possibility and to give a 31 AD crucifixion further consideration.)<br /><br />As for Humphreys’ exegesis of the Gospels’ accounts of Jesus’ trial, Humphreys gives a detailed argument for his position, which strikes me as quite persuasive. The situation as far as the arrest and trial narratives are concerned is not straightforward, as is implied by the reviewer’s statement, “The Synoptics and John clearly suggest the passing of only one night before Jesus execution”. (Note here the notion of a ‘clear suggestion’.) The “much more natural reading” of the Gospels proposed by the reviewer is quite possible, but then so is Humphreys’. For my part, I would prefer simply to say that both readings are possible, rather than strongly come down on one side or the other.<br /><br />Ultimately, for what it’s worth, I believe Humphreys’ view to be a very plausible--persuasive even--and undoubtedly fascinating and thought-provoking one. I also believe the reviewer’s view to be plausible. (I have read his book on the matter, which I would also recommend. It contains a wealth of information, all of which is clearly documented and discussed, and goes beyond a mere rehash of old arguments due to its thorough treatment of Second Temple literature, although, in my view, it overlooks the odd reference here and there, such as a Mishnaic reference that implies a time for the Passover sacrifice prior to 3 p.m.)<br /><br />James Bejon.James Bejonhttps://independent.academia.edu/jamesbejonnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8637125351921336084.post-50899616654734489042016-02-24T01:27:22.986-08:002016-02-24T01:27:22.986-08:00Regardless of the differences in possible calculat...Regardless of the differences in possible calculations, the fact is that the OT points to Nisan (Babylonian name) 14, which makes sense according to the cycles of 7 and apparent Sabbath identity of God. Christ likewise, most certainly celebrated Passover when it was correct to practice it, according to the time it was given, and not by a contrived amendment or evolutionary change brought about by Jewish historical changes in the day. Nisan 14 at the time God gave it, was still Nisan 14 at the time of Christ. This is the critical point in understanding the behavior of Christ at that time. Likewise, it would seem to me, that the Jewish changes to Passover, etc. must be considered in light of the Jewish calendar, and not the Roman calendar. Adding Roman calendar references to a sacred event would seem to be misleading in terms of the way the sacred record actually views the events in terms of time. Is that not so? Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8637125351921336084.post-15713826452778969442016-01-24T15:59:42.699-08:002016-01-24T15:59:42.699-08:00Thank you for your review of The Mystery of the La...Thank you for your review of The Mystery of the Last Supper by Colin Humphreys.<br /><br />After reading your review, I started studying the writings of Josephus more carefully and discovered that Josephus seems to flatly contradict himself on the subject of the length of the Feast of Unleavened Bread and apparently also on the date of the First Day of the Feast of Unleavened Bread.<br /><br />In Antiquities 2.317, Josephus writes:<br />Thus it is that, in memory of the want we were then in, we keep a feast for eight days, which is called the Feast of Unleavened Bread.<br /><br />However, in Antiquities 3.249, he writes:<br />The Feast of Unleavened Bread succeeds that of the Passover, and falls on the fifteenth day of the month, and continues seven days, wherein they feed on unleavened bread; … But on the second day of unleavened bread, which is the sixteenth day of the month, they first eat of the fruits of the earth …<br /><br />The first passage can be used to support your viewpoint and the second one seems to lend support to Dr. Humphreys’ viewpoint. <br /><br />I have not found a place where Josephus gives an explanation for this contradiction. As a result, it seems to me that the writings of Josephus too ambiguous and indefinite to settle the questions that need to be answered. It looks to me like they are another dead end. <br /><br />If this is correct, then we cannot use Josephus’s writings to determine whether the wording in Mark 14:12 is “anomalous” or not. We will have to look for other clues in other places if we want to find a way to answer the questions that we have about the Last Supper.<br /><br />Luke 22:7 is not decisive either, because it is fully consistent with your theory and Dr. Humphreys’ theory too.Paul Tannernoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8637125351921336084.post-19906222887286907432016-01-10T14:41:23.734-08:002016-01-10T14:41:23.734-08:00A larger methodological point, relevant to memory ...A larger methodological point, relevant to memory theory and historical Jesus research, might be made here. If finally in the Bible, the facts of astronomy are at times modified by human frailties, and the subjectivity of human perception. <br /><br />No matter when the moon actually was first there, a major element determining what was finally done, was the moment when fallible human beings finally perceived it.<br /><br />So a human subjectivity is evident.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8637125351921336084.post-10350125033107914462016-01-09T09:55:10.147-08:002016-01-09T09:55:10.147-08:00Thank you Mark! I appreciate the kind words and th...Thank you Mark! I appreciate the kind words and the link. I missed that post, and look forward to reading it. Brant Pitrehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12537247176808981484noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8637125351921336084.post-82467145894532199472016-01-08T13:16:48.816-08:002016-01-08T13:16:48.816-08:00Excellent treatment, Brant. Clear and very helpful...Excellent treatment, Brant. Clear and very helpful. <br /><br />I posted some of my own thoughts a couple of years ago on my blog here, and there is some similarity, especially on the question of the last supper / cock crow / this night material:<br /><br />http://ntweblog.blogspot.com/2011/04/dating-last-supper-day-early.html .Mark Goodacrehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05115370166754797529noreply@blogger.com